I asked how he had felt towards Klopstock in his youth.  “I venerated him,” said Goethe, “with the devotion which was peculiar to me; I looked upon him as my uncle.  I revered whatever he had done, and never thought of reflecting upon it, or finding fault with it.  I let his fine qualities work upon me; for the rest, I went my own way.”

We came back to Herder, and I asked Goethe which of his works he thought the best. “His Idea for the History of Mankind” (Ideen zur Geschichte der Menschheit), replied Goethe, “are undoubtedly the best.  In after days, he took the negative side, and was not so agreeable.”

“Considering the great weight of Herder,” said I, “I cannot understand how he had so little judgment on some subjects.  For instance, I cannot forgive him, especially at that period of German literature, for sending back the manuscript of Goetz von Berlichingen without any praise of its merits, and with taunting remarks.  He must have utterly wanted organs to perceive some objects.”

“Yes, Herder was unfortunate in this respect,” replied Goethe; “nay,” added he, with vivacity, “if his spirit were present at this conversation, it would not understand us.”

“On the other hand,” said I, “I must praise Merck, who urged you to print Goetz.”

“He was indeed an odd but important man,” said Goethe. “’Print the thing,’ quoth he, ‘it is worth nothing, but print it.’  He did not wish me to make any alteration in it, and he was right; for it would have been different, but not better.”

Wednesday, November 24.—­I went to see Goethe this evening, before going to the theatre, and found him very well and cheerful.  He inquired about the young Englishmen who are here.  I told him that I proposed reading with Mr. Doolan a German translation of Plutarch.  This led the conversation to Roman and Grecian history; and Goethe expressed himself as follows: 

“The Roman history,” said he, “is no longer suited to us.  We have become too humane for the triumphs of Caesar not to be repugnant to our feelings.  Neither are we much charmed by the history of Greece.  When this people turns against a foreign foe, it is, indeed, great and glorious; but the division of the states, and their eternal wars with one another, where Greek fights against Greek, are insufferable.  Besides, the history of our own time is thoroughly great and important; the battles of Leipsic and Waterloo stand out with such prominence that that of Marathon and others like it are gradually eclipsed.  Neither are our individual heroes inferior to theirs; the French Marshals, Bluecher, and Wellington, vie with any of the heroes of antiquity.”

We then talked of the late French literature, and the daily increasing interest in German works manifested by the French.

“The French,” said Goethe, “do well to study and translate our writers; for, limited as they are both in form and motives, they can only look without for means.  We Germans may be reproached for a certain formlessness; but in matter we are their superiors.  The theatrical productions of Kotzebue and Iffland are so rich in motives that they may pluck them a long time before all is used up.  But, especially, our philosophical Ideality is welcome to them; for every Ideal is serviceable to revolutionary aims.